Deep Space Acadamy

[Darrik 0]

Since we do have a truckstop, er, I mean space station, how would you like the idea of having a space station acadamy every once and awhile?

[William Laiden 0]

I'm just popping onto the boards after 2 months in Hiatis and I think a Star Base Academy would be fun!

[Seiben 0]

IT really is up to the GMs in charge, but you never know. Not all of the academies are federation Starship ones.

[FredM 0]

Hey there,

 

As mentioned, not every Academy sim takes place aboard a regular Federation starship. I have seen quite a few sims which take place in the 23rd Century, on a Klingon ship, a Romulan ship and more than a few take place soley on planets (no ship involved). While having a starbase based Academy once in a blue moon would be interesting, it would also be somewhat problematic. Positions normally found on a Starbase do not always match up to those located on a ship. You wouldn't want someone to get great at being a Flight Operations Manager, only to find out after graduation there's only one post in the entire fleet matching that title and it's filled. :/

[Dumbass 0]

and more than a few take place soley on planets (no ship involved).

Of course this doesn't stop the GMs from assigning Helm and Ops and CENG anyway :P

 

The one plot I've seen that doesn't work is Borg. Everyone essentially repeats what the CO/Queen says. It's very efficient, but ultimately very boring.

 

If anyone ever does an all-Pakled sim, let me know. :D

[Darrik 0]

Fred, that was one of the reasons that I wanted to ask this, since we have Federation acadamies, and federation ships, Rinashu acadamies, and a rinashu ship (sorry if i spelt it wrong), Klingon acadamies, and a half-klingon ship, we have no starbase acadamy, and a starbase.

 

 

Also Fred, you said that there's only one position on Flight Ops. One, flight ops is somewhat like ops, and, if it's such a problem, why not make another opening, *hint hint* eh?

[Commodore Moose 0]

If anyone ever does an all-Pakled sim, let me know.

 

I've never started off with the intent of doing an all-Pakled sim. However, at the end of the night, some of them have felt that way. : )

[Dumbass 0]

Fred, that was one of the reasons that I wanted to ask this, since we have Federation acadamies, and federation ships, Rinashu acadamies, and a rinashu ship (sorry if i spelt it wrong), Klingon acadamies, and a half-klingon ship, we have no starbase acadamy, and a starbase.

 

 

Also Fred, you said that there's only one position on Flight Ops. One, flight ops is somewhat like ops, and, if it's such a problem, why not make another opening, *hint hint* eh?

It does seem logical that a starbase Advanced Sim would have an occasional Academy counterpart considering that the other "special" cases do. However, I disagree that OPS would be synonimous with Flight Ops.

 

The way I see it, and have played it, the OPS position is something like an overall IT person - the person who keeps the systems running, including power distribution, but wouldn't necessarily be the end user of those systems. They may be assigned things like transporters and other engineering responsibilities and things like communications and sensors (which can also be handled by Tactical, a position I think is underutilized as Tactical and CSEC are often combined and I don't think they should be) but the primary responsibility would be to keep the IT and power infrastructure running so that specific systems can be operated by the relevant departments. I'm not saying this is the only way to play the roll, but it is what has worked for me.

 

A "Flight Ops" person would be like a modern-day air traffic controller. There would be a need for this on a starbase since ships are constantly coming and going, but I've never seen more than 2 shuttles used at the same time (both in sim and in Trek) so there probably isn't much call for it on a ship.

 

Of course the main problem is we really only have 3 Trek examples to follow, Data - who had the skills to do everything under the sun and often did so, O'Brien - who was really more of a CENG than OPS, and Kim - who spent most of his time dying in some way or trying to make Captain instead of doing his OPS job.

 

Just my thoughts.

Edited August 17, 2004 by Dumbass

[Tachyon 0]

Of course the main problem is we really only have 3 Trek examples to follow, Data - who had the skills to do everything under the sun and often did so, O'Brien - who was really more of a CENG than OPS, and Kim - who spent most of his time dying in some way or trying to make Captain instead of doing his OPS job.

Also, both Data and Kim were on ships with no real Chief Science Officer, so they also had to play CSCI.

 

The hardest thing I find about Flight Ops is keeping myself busy. Especially when nobody can dock with the station . . . :D But it's still a great job, being a manager with no underlings to worry about.

 

As for Starbase Academies . . . if the GM says it will be set on a Starbase, I'm fine with that. I don't think I'd want a regular, weekly one, but once and awhile.

[Darrik 0]

As for Starbase Academies . . . if the GM says it will be set on a Starbase, I'm fine with that. I don't think I'd want a regular, weekly one, but once and awhile.

Again, it's up to the gms, but one or two every month would be fine to me.

[NDak 0]

Well echo'ing the GM's and others, I think it would be nice to have Starbase Academy once and while, but to set a quota for howmany they should have, or having one academy that is always Starbase set is IMO a bad idea.

 

The reason many of adv. players go to the Academies is to be able to sim plot lines that we normally wouldn't get to do in the Adv. Sims. If we wanted to play on a truckstop, we'd join the Aegis :D

 

Also it think it bares repeating that yes Starbase sims have postitions that are unique, but most of those are already taken. And as we all know many cadets get in a habit of doing the same post over and over again. So if you were someone who only went to the starbase acad and only played Flight Operations Manager, your going to be in a world of hurt if thats the only position you learned to play :P

 

As for the OPS position I agree with Van Roy. Operations should be more of a IT/Powerflow job. But every sim is different. Most ships usually combine bridge jobs. And why is that?? To give everyone something to do. There are times when being a helmsman means I litterally have nothing to do. Thankfully that charcter has a background in Science so when I am bored I go pester Lo'Ami.

 

I know that everyone always shoots for those cushy bridge jobs where you sit and tap buttons, but I think that one thing you should consider is: How bored do you want to be? If your someone who can handle sitting and tapping buttons for long periods of time--go for it. If not I suggest staying away from those untill you've gotten some time under your belt as other positions....

 

Anyway...here is one example (from the USS Republic Sim Policies) of what a Operations officer is supposed to do:

 

Operations/Communications: Responsible for handling the extra and intra-ship communications. Also responsible for coordination of the various departmental functions aboard the ship. Also able to assist the Helm when needed.

 

And here is one from STSF Help Section

Ops: <OPS>: Operations Management. Oversees most ship operations and mission management. Also primary contact station for communications.

 

::tosses in his two cents::

Edited August 17, 2004 by NDak

[Dumbass 0]

Operations/Communications: Responsible for handling the extra and intra-ship communications. Also responsible for coordination of the various departmental functions aboard the ship. Also able to assist the Helm when needed.

 

And here is one from STSF Help Section

Ops: <OPS>: Operations Management. Oversees most ship operations and mission management. Also primary contact station for communications.

To me, "responsible for coordination of the various departmental functions aboard the ship" and "overseas most ship operations and mission management" makes it look like OPS is a command position. If so, OPS should wear red, and it is not a position you would give to an Ensign.

 

Responding to an earlier comment, I think 7 of 9 was pretty much an unofficial CSCI.

Edited August 17, 2004 by Dumbass

[Darrik 0]

yes, but couldn't you be in a command position and still wear yellow or blue?

[Dumbass 0]

yes, but couldn't you be in a command position and still wear yellow or blue?

It depends on what is a bigger factor in the OPS position, whether it is the technical aspect or the command/control aspect. From the definitions I've seen it looks like the command/control aspect is more important so the position would wear red. However, if OPS were more like my IT example it would wear yellow.

 

There is no rule saying someone wearing yellow or blue can't hold command rank, but the rank would ideally be based on the person and not the position, unless the position was CO or XO (in which case the person would wear red anyway if it is TNG-era or later). What makes a good commander is a separate issue than what career path positions like Helm or Ops or Tactical should fall into. You don't need to be a good commander to know how to fly a ship or fire phasers.

 

Of course there is hope for the future. We've already moved beyond judging people by the color of their skin. Now all we have to do is stop judging people by the color of their shirts. :D

Edited August 18, 2004 by Dumbass

[NDak 0]

I see your point Van Roy...although some how we have once again managed to get way off the orignal topic :P

 

I think what it means by coordinating is that they are in charge of the techinal logistics of the operation, such as telling the Captain that beaming down may not be wise :D

[Dumbass 0]

I think what it means by coordinating is that they are in charge of the techinal logistics of the operation, such as telling the Captain that beaming down may not be wise :D

An Ensign wouldn't have that kind of clout, but a Lieutenant Commander might.

 

The problem in deciding what the proper OPS role is is Data, or more specifically Brent Spiner. He defined the OPS role for people like O'Brien and Kim to follow In some ways they measure up, in some ways they don't. The problem is Data/Brent was able to make the separate roles of OPS and 2nd Officer appear seamless to us so we have to ask ourselves "OK, when Data was doing this, did he do so because he was 2nd Officer or because he was OPS or because he was simply an efficient Android?" The only way out of that debate is to compare specific responsibilities of Data, O'Brien, and Kim and define the OPS position as whatever all 3 of them did. The only commonality I can find is that all 3 maintained the ship/station systems, and it doesn't take command authority to do that.

 

However, I DO think OPS should be a Bridge Officer position, and thus be capable of command in the right circumstances, even though they wear yellow. Why? Because the Bridge is the nerve center of the entire ship and it's OPS job to maintain the nerve center as that's where most of the vital systems's end users (with the exception of Engineering) will be.

 

I guess what I am saying is that STSF's definitions for OPS seem to be based mostly on Data's example and that it seems (at least to me) to be inconsistent with the rest of Trek. Then again it may just be my Vulcan character working overtime. :P

Edited August 18, 2004 by Dumbass

[Dumbass 0]

Anyway, getting back to the original topic, I said "Yes."

[FredM 0]

I guess what I am saying is that STSF's definitions for OPS seem to be based mostly on Data's example and that it seems (at least to me) to be inconsistent with the rest of Trek. Then again it may just be my Vulcan character working overtime. :D

Hey there,

 

One thing many people seem to forget is that Lieutenant Commander Data was not just the Operations Manager for the 1701-D/1701-E, but he also served (best anyone can tell) as the ship's Chief Science Officer.

 

This is something that was seen again on Voyager, but wasn't seen on Deep Space Nine...nor any other Trek incarnation. This present's an issue, whereby individuals see what Data (or Kim) did and believe that to be OPS' responsibility. Problem is that what you saw is only about half, with the other being that of the CSCI.

 

Dealing with OPS on a starbase, I can tell you on Aegis we recently changed quite a few things dealing with the sim's structure. There are now two seperate Operation Managers. There is SOPS, or Station Operations, and FOPS, or Flight Operations. The first basically acts as someone who manages communications, deals with items once they are physically on the station. The later is, best term available, Aegis Air Traffic Control. :P

[Dumbass 0]

That would make Fred the SLOPS - Shore Leave Operations :)

 

Maybe it's because I only started watching Voyager regularly after 7 of 9 joined the crew (nothing about the series, I just didn't have a TV at the time) but I never really thought of Kim as a CSCI.

 

Then again, I still can't imagine Kroells as CSCI. :P

Edited August 18, 2004 by Dumbass

[NDak 0]

The one thing that always bothered me was the lack of a real science officer on TNG. While Data dutifully maintained the role with out title, it seems to me highly unlikely that on a ship whose primary mission is exploration that you wouldn't have a CSCI figuring prominatly. (Then again I have a quote on the Republic about that: "No one ever listens to the Scientests untill something goes wrong, then they wanted to know about it yesterday, oh and fix it for them too." :) )

 

Operations should be exactly what it sounds like: Maintaining Operations of the Vessel.

 

Mission OPS: (A title you can find in certain techinal books etc.) is usually the post that is in charge of making sure away missions are going smoothly, but then how man times have you seen someone posted as MISSION OPS (MOPS)?

 

I think as far as sims go, it should be up to the GM team of what they want their bridge officers to do. On the Republic for example we only have 2 real bridge positions: Helm/TAC and OPS/TAC. But then on the Arcadia we have TAC, Helm, OPS and Counselor.

 

And I have a point ::rambles:: that links back to the Main topic at hand. I don't think its a good idea to have set positions for anything or set plots for acads for the sheer reason that it limits the ability of the GM to change the perimeters of the game to suite the style and/or the personal available.

 

And I think the ability to change the exact duties of a position is supported by what we have seen on the show. How many people had the same title and did the exact same job on every series? (Maybe Medical but even then some of them have had to play counselor and others no.) It would seem to me that Starfleet gives leway to Captains to decide how a ship is ran.

 

 

 

::throws in his two cents::

[STSF_BluRox 0]

The one plot I've seen that doesn't work is Borg. Everyone essentially repeats what the CO/Queen says. It's very efficient, but ultimately very boring.

 

If anyone ever does an all-Pakled sim, let me know. :)

Yea, that Borg Sim they kept clamoring for was an absolute bust. We didn't make it 10 minutes until everyone asked to stop and do a regular sim. LOL, they've never asked for it again either!

 

However, don't tell me you haven't made it to one of our Assimilated Pakled Academy sims? Things were....interesting to say the least....let alone...the poor toaster....

 

Blu

[Seiben 0]

Yea, that Borg Sim they kept clamoring for was an absolute bust. We didn't make it 10 minutes until everyone asked to stop and do a regular sim. LOL, they've never asked for it again either!

 

However, don't tell me you haven't made it to one of our Assimilated Pakled Academy sims? Things were....interesting to say the least....let alone...the poor toaster....

 

Blu

"The borg we are, assimillated you will be.." yeah, assimilated Pakled Borg sim; good times, good times.. :)

[Dumbass 0]

However, don't tell me you haven't made it to one of our Assimilated Pakled Academy sims? Things were....interesting to say the least....let alone...the poor toaster....

Yup, those are a riot! The funny part isn't the plot itself, it's watching the newer cadets take everything so seriously! :)

[NDak 0]

"The borg we are, assimillated you will be.." yeah, assimilated Pakled Borg sim; good times, good times.. :P

Isn't it more like:

 

"We Borg, You become us, no fighting us" B) :)

[Vex Xiang 0]

Why not go to the schedule, e-mail one of the GMs, and get them excited about the idea? Have them e-mail you when they plan to do the starbase sim, if they like it, and then you can schedule yourself to attend that sim.