Where did Voyager go wrong?

[Tuvok 0]

Hey there,

 

This is a point that shouldn't be overlooked. As crazy as it sounds, The Doctor became a more important character to people than Janeway or the rest of them. I mean, honestly, I would have been fine with him getting back to the Alpha Quadrant and the rest ending up in a black hole. ^_^

Some how I have to agree, I don't want the rest of them to die, but the doctor did become a main part of the show.

[Sam_SemaJ 0]

i like chakotay, if i was him...i would realize, "hey, we're screwed out here. I have SF training, i will be looked to, the best thing i can do is work positively. Support Janeway as much as i can so we can get through this mess."

 

I was drum major (student director, superior 'officer' to the student leaders) for our competitive marching band. In a way I was XO to the Directors (one of three XO's). I attended a camp to train for this. We learned the Most important job a drum major has is to support his directors program.

[Grom 0]

Hey there,

 

This is a point that shouldn't be overlooked. As crazy as it sounds, The Doctor became a more important character to people than Janeway or the rest of them. I mean, honestly, I would have been fine with him getting back to the Alpha Quadrant and the rest ending up in a black hole. ^_^

No holograms were hurt in the making of this production...

[Sam_SemaJ 0]

i like chakotay, if i was him...i would realize, "hey, we're screwed out here. I have SF training, i will be looked to, the best thing i can do is work positively. Support Janeway as much as i can so we can get through this mess."

 

I was drum major (student director, superior 'officer' to the student leaders) for our competitive marching band. In a way I was XO to the Directors (one of three XO's). I attended a camp to train for this. We learned the Most important job a drum major has is to support his directors program.

i actually wouldnt have really liked it if there was the constant dissension of a power struggle going on, i would want them to work together...which they did

Edited January 6, 2005 by Sam_SemaJ

[STSF Laura 0]

Voyager was actually my favorite of the Trek series. I enjoyed TNG, especially during the later seasons, and I was/am a big fan of the kind of long-term arc that DS9 used, but I felt that DS9 dropped in and out quality-wise, and its final season I really couldn't have cared less about. I cannot stand ENT on the whole, although I've caught a few bits and pieces that I enjoyed. TOS I feel rather neutral about; on the one hand, if it were new today, I would hate it; on the other hand, I can appreciate it for what it was in its day.

 

I divide Voyager into two parts: pre-season 4 and post-season 4. And I ignore the existance of season 4 whenever possible. It really does seem like two different shows, and I agree that the post-season 4 Voyager is much better. As several others have pointed out, Trek series need a couple seasons to find their feet.

 

I thought the cast had an excellent dynamic, and I'm going to completely disagree with Grom on the character ratings. I'm also going to disagree with whomever said Seven and Tuvok shouldn't have scenes together -- one of the best things about those scenes was that the actors did manage to imbue an emotional underpinning in them, despite the control of the characters. I mourn the fact that the writers didn't seem to know what to do with Chakotay's character, because there was a great deal of potential there, but that's my only major character complaint.

 

The Borg issue and the Gamma Quadrant wormhole were the major stumbling blocks for me in terms of the series' credibility; I didn't find the long-term encounters with aliens all that odd. The had far-flung areas of influence; so does the Federation. Realistically (if we can apply the term to a sci-fi show), it takes about a year to cross the Federation at warp 9.99. (ST Encyclopedia) That has a tendency to get ignored rather frequently, of course, like when a fleet gets sent to DS9 from Earth.

 

Did Voyager have bad episodes? I refer you to the package of trite cliches and character assassination that called itself season 4. But, oh, man, when they got it right... Wow.

 

As for the books... Peter David has personal issues with the series; he refers to it rather bitterly if he speaks about it at conventions and the like. He swore once he would never write for it. So you won't find any Voyager books by him.... under that name, anyway. ::coughs:: The team of Dean Wesley Smith and Kristine Kathryn Rusch have done some nice work with VOY books. But, if you want my opinion on the best writer doing Voyager work, check out Christie Golden's stuff. It's better than the series, whether you consider that saying a lot or very little. ^_^ She's been rather prolific with Voyager books, but I don't know if she's written for any other series; she's rather new as recurring Trek novel writers go. She's written a post-finale wrap-up pair of books: Homecoming and The Farther Shore, which I recommend to anyone who felt the finale ended about an act too soon.

[Captain Huff 0]

Yes indeed, I love topics on Voyager!

 

Let's see... What Moose calls "whussed" I call "inspired." ^_^ How could they *ever* have dragged out a Federation/Maqui conflict for seven seasons?? They wrapped it up in the amount of time it should have been and moved on. What they moved on to is what I love the most about the series. We're trapped here, we're stuck here, what the xxxx do we do with our time? Now THAT is what makes good character TV for me. Forced microcosm society... Perfect.

 

I'm now thinking perhaps I shouldn't buy season 4, lol. (I never payed attention to the season numbers when I watched, so I don't recall where the sucky ones are).

 

Grom... You and I tend to disagree on most board topics ANYway, so I will happily stick to my ensemble cast love affair with Voyager. ::grin::

 

I do agree that more alien races should have been used rather than recurring ones. Revisiting old themes is a seductive trap for writing plots, and I wrestle with this on the Qob, since we're on a Voyager-esque path. (Our solution is to take what we like from a race and move on. It's usually something we can eat.)

 

Laura, you and I need to Voyager-bond over an espresso and chocolate some afternoon IRL.

 

And last, I can't/won't offer opinions on Voyager books since I just can't stomach Trek books of ANY kind. I keep trying, I just can't take pulp in written form the same way I can take it in television form, alas. I don't like Voyager books, I don't like TNG books, I just don't like Trek books, even the great ones that have been recommended. I see it as a personal quirk, so please don't think I'm putting down anyone who likes Trek books!

 

Plague report: I slept 12 hours last night and while I'm starting to rejoin the living today, I have to stay home ANYway since everything has been snowed out from a storm, lol. Guess I'll just HAVE to watch more Trek on DVD!

[FredM 0]

I mourn the fact that the writers didn't seem to know what to do with Chakotay's character, because there was a great deal of potential there, but that's my only major character complaint.

Hey there,

 

See, this is a problem I have. While I liked Star Trek: Voyager - After Season 4 Era, way too much time was spent trying to "create" this character of Seven of Nine. This caused many of the other characters, and their potential, to collapse.

 

Like it or not, approve of it or not, the writers ignored wonderful opportunities to expand different aspects. Chakotay and in a lot of ways Tuvok were perfect examples of this. Tuvok started out the show as Janeway's right hand man, the "Spock" to her "Kirk." Thing was, as the show moved forward, that dynamic started to change...but it was never actually discussed. There wasn't an episode, or even a scene, where Tuvok contemplated the fact he wasn't "as in the loop" as he might have been prior.

 

As for Chakotay, Robert Beltran really was right when he went in a tirade somewhere around season five or six. They were completely ignoring his character. It's possible that because he publically called them on the carpet for this they purposefully decided to ignore his role and give as little screen time as possible.

[Sam_SemaJ 0]

i noticed a bit of a trend, not from everyone, but from some. a lot of people seem to stick by the're first watched trek...i got hooked on trek through voyager, one of you...um...elders (sounds more distinguished) may love the original. I think whatever brought each of us into the star trek loop is what we tend to idolize. Regardless of how many impossible shuttles we can count on a tiny ship...we all love trek enough to be HERE.

[Dumbass 0]

Well, my first-watched Trek was TOS. And I agree with Sam that most of it was pure crap (well, as pure as crap can be anyway - you know what I mean). The only episodes I really got into were "A Piece of the Action" for the sheer comedy of seeing Spock try to be a gangster and "Mirror, Mirror." In my opinion DS9 completely ruined the "Mirror Universe" concept which is but one of many reasons I didn't like DS9 either.

 

Heck, I didn't even like "Amok Time", and for a guy who sims as a Vulcan to disregard a Pon Farr episode is pretty bad.

 

Come to think of it, I'm starting to think that there isn't a Vulcan in existance that has a fairly routine Pon Farr. They always seem to fight their bosses, or have to use a Holodeck, or experience rapid aging, or something else that goes wrong. It's a miracle we can reproduce at all! ^_^

[Saek tr'Vosh 0]

I mean, honestly, I would have been fine with him getting back to the Alpha Quadrant and the rest ending up in a black hole. :)

Now that would have been a completely different finale....

 

A totally different crew arrives in the alpha quadrant..on a limping vessel....60 yrs later....with Captain Doctor... ^_^

Edited January 6, 2005 by Saek tr'Vosh

[STSF Laura 0]

Laura, you and I need to Voyager-bond over an espresso and chocolate some afternoon IRL.

Ooooh.... Chocolate. I'm there!