Best Star Trek Villian

[NDak 0]

Hmm decisions, decisions.

[William Laiden 0]

I voted for the Xindi because they are whole species that want to destroy human kind.

[Nemesis 0]

I say Shinzon, because he was the complete equal to Picard. He was imperfect aswell bent on a revenge that was directed towards the wrong person. I also loved Khan.

[Grom 0]

Q.

[Dumbass 0]

Khan didn't really ask to be genetically enhanced, and all that time on Ceti Alpha 5 would play hell with anyone's psyche.

 

General Chang had a cool ship but he wasn't any more evil than other Klingons of the time.

 

Dukat I don't know too much about. I wasn't a DS9 person.

 

Brunt was a typical Ferengi accountant. So what? That's his job.

 

Q had the needs of the entire multiverse to think about, and humanity *is* insignificant compared to that. It's an awesome responsibility and I don't think Humanity could do any better.

 

Soran was a villan, but nothing special about him.

 

The Son'a were spoiled-brat children. Easily handled.

 

The Borg Queen is a threat, but I wouldn't call her evil. She does have a desire to bring other species to "perfection", it's just that she defines it differently then we do.

 

Shin'Zon didn't ask to be a clone, and he did have a survival need to go after Picard. That is not evil.

 

The Xindi I don't know much about.

 

So for me that leaves - you guessed it - Berman and Braga!

[NDak 0]

I voted for the Xindi because they are whole species that want to destroy human kind.

And that would make them different from the Borg, Shin'Zon, and Q how? ;)

Edited April 4, 2004 by Ern_Ndak

[Tovan 0]

I say Berman and Braga their stories some times are just creepy. wooooooo.......

Edited April 4, 2004 by Tovan

[Feanor 0]

I voted for Berman and Braga, but in my opinion the Borg, pre Voyager which ruined them and Pre Queen which was just sort of strange were the best villian in Trek History. They aren't really a species or race...but a single collective creature bent on plowing under everything that exists in persuit of its own goals. Without emotion or conscience to guide them, they don't care what you've achieved unless it enhances them, they don't care what your philosophy of life is, their only drive is to pursue that which will enhance the whole. Focused, driven relentless and completely useless to even try to reason with them because you are inferior and you will be assimilated.

 

The others were amatures, the borg are darkness.

[Holden 0]

ummmmmm....what he said!

[William Laiden 0]

And that would make them different from the Borg, Shin'Zon, and Q how? ;)

Oh, well, hmmm... ;)

[Merina 0]

I voted for the Xindi, because of how we go the TOS, TNG, DS9, and VOY episodes. Thank you have a nice day.

[Tovan 0]

I voted for Berman and Braga, but in my opinion the Borg, pre Voyager which ruined them and Pre Queen which was just sort of strange were the best villian in Trek History. They aren't really a species or race...but a single collective creature bent on plowing under everything that exists in persuit of its own goals. Without emotion or conscience to guide them, they don't care what you've achieved unless it enhances them, they don't care what your philosophy of life is, their only drive is to pursue that which will enhance the whole. Focused, driven relentless and completely useless to even try to reason with them because you are inferior and you will be assimilated.

 

The others were amatures, the borg are darkness.

Told ya they were creepy woooooooooo....

[Ki'rok 0]

Im sorry..but I think Khan lost some tacos out of the twelve pack long before the superior intellect took effect.

 

But the category can be broken down into sub-categories..and really needs to...

 

Best Star Trek villain covers a LOT of the quadrant.

 

For example, if we are talking ::glances at Dak:: most Evil?

 

That would have to be the ball of sludge from Skin of Evil (TNG). I mean..killing Tasha...just because...thats evil.

 

Coolest villain?? While Im not sure Q is TECHNICALLY a villain..rather mischevious, absolutely.

 

Grossest Villain...the harvestors from Voyager freaked me out...space zombies...

 

Best Chest Prosthetic....................... ;)

[Marris Krax 0]

And that would make them different from the Borg, Shin'Zon, and Q how?  :)

Yanno, Q gets a really bad rap. He isn't really a villian! He's an imp, a trickster, but all in all, he's really (shocker) a good guy. Everything he does has the distinct purpose of getting humanity off its ass to make it better, even if he does it in a mean way most of the time. To challenge. Q is a teacher, not a villian, though perhaps there isn't much of a distinction there ;)

 

However, I can pretty much guarantee that Q wasn't out to destroy humanity :angry:

 

And I shall now put my vote in for B&B. I can't in good conscience vote for my true favorite villian (the Borg) because that tag team essentially...well...I don't think that's appropriate language for these boards ;)

Edited April 5, 2004 by Marris Krax

[Ki'rok 0]

Yanno, Q gets a really bad rap. He isn't really a villian! He's an imp, a trickster, but all in all, he's really (shocker) a good guy. Everything he does has the distinct purpose of getting humanity off its ass to make it better, even if he does it in a mean way most of the time. To challenge. Q is a teacher, not a villian, though perhaps there isn't much of a distinction there :)

 

I love it when people agree with me without even seeing my post... ;)

 

I feel sooo validated ;)

[Travis Kroells 0]

and Q how? ;)

Wow Ndak! You totaly hit your thumb with the hammer on that one!

 

Q never wanted to destroy us. If he did we'd be gone, simple as that.

 

I think that if you, I, or espically Vanroy had that power, we'd play around with it. That's all we are, his playthings.

[NDak 0]

I actualy disagree...He may not be evil (although he certainly has killed a good number of people over time) Q is a villain by defintion...(wow i just realized i spelled it wrong on the orignal post ;) )

 

vil·lain n.

1. A wicked or evil person; a scoundrel.

2. A dramatic or fictional character who is typically at odds with the hero.

3. A vile, wicked person; a man extremely depraved, and capable or guilty of great crimes; a deliberate scoundrel; a knave; a rascal; a scamp.

 

This is a creature who gets his kicks out of playing with the lesser species of the universe (just ask Guinan) and he was so corrupt in his Q-powers that he had them taken away. Add to that he does just enjoy playing with us, we are like flys he enjoys pulling the wings off of (why BTW is the first sign of psychotic behavior) Saying Q is not a villain is like saying the Vorlon's or Shadows form B5 weren't, after all they justed wanted to teach humanity how to be better ;)

 

And for clarification...being a villain doesn't make you"evil" although it certain doesn't help...the questions was supposed to be who was "best" Villan not neccissarly who is the most evil of them (becuase I thnk Dukat who was actualy ypossesed by Evil itself would win thayt contest--that would also eliminate the B-B twins because its take intellegence to be evil and yeah...we will leave it at that )...but meh...

 

I personally think Khan was the most interesting (and best acted) Villian of all time in ST...with the Borg and Dukat close on his heals. Khan was the perfect match for the 'almighty' Kirk. he was smarter, stronger, and driven completly driven blind with hatred "with my lest breath I spit at the..."

Edited April 5, 2004 by Ern_Ndak

[Marris Krax 0]

I actualy disagree...He may not be evil (although he certainly has killed a good number of people over time) Q is a villain by defintion...(wow i just realized i spelled it wrong on the orignal post :) )

 

vil·lain n.

1. A wicked or evil person; a scoundrel.

2. A dramatic or fictional character who is typically at odds with the hero.

3. A vile, wicked person; a man extremely depraved, and capable or guilty of great crimes; a deliberate scoundrel; a knave; a rascal; a scamp.

 

This is a creature who gets his kicks out of playing with the lesser species of the universe (just ask Guinan) and he was so corrupt in his Q-powers that he had them taken away. Add to that he does just enjoy playing with us, we are like flys he enjoys pulling the wings off of (why BTW is the first sign of psychotic behavior) Saying Q is not a villain is like saying the Vorlon's or Shadows form B5 weren't, after all they justed wanted to teach humanity how to be better ;)

 

And for clarification...being a villain doesn't make you"evil" although it certain doesn't help...the questions was supposed to be who was "best" Villan not neccissarly who is the most evil of them (becuase I thnk Dukat who was actualy ypossesed by Evil itself would win thayt contest--that would also eliminate the B-B twins because its take intellegence to be evil and yeah...we will leave it at that )...but meh...

 

I personally think Khan was the most interesting (and best acted) Villian of all time in ST...with the Borg and Dukat close on his heals. Khan was the perfect match for the 'almighty' Kirk. he was smarter, stronger, and driven completly driven blind with hatred "with my lest breath I spit at the..."

::blinky:: ;)

 

Okay, the only reason Q would be considered a villian by that definition would be because he's against Picard...unless my overworked and sleep deprived brain is missing something.

 

Q's motivations were never really to "mess" with us. That is just how we percieve it. By "messing" with us, he pushes us, like the teacher who plays devil's advocate. Now, I never watched B5, but those people were actively trying to kill and/or conquer (no matter how I spell that it looks wrong, ROFL, I need to go to bed) the main characters of the show, were they not? Q's only motive that I see is to better us, to make us think in different ways. Yeah, he probably had fun with Picard and Co. along with that, but I've always seen the jerk as a facade meant to goad the poor corporeal humans along. Q's pretty damn gentle with humanity, if you ask me. Tell me a time when Q ever actually harmed anyone and *then* I might conceed that he is a villian.

 

Oh, and as for Q getting his powers taken away by the Continuum...wasn't that punishment for giving Riker Q powers that one time? Again, that seems to me to be more of a civil disobedience thing, breaking/bending the rules a bit for the betterment of all.

 

But, these are just the ramblings of a very sleep deprived individual, so allow me to do the unthinkable and go to bed before 11:00 (10:00, if you take into consideration that daylight saving kicked in and my internal clock has yet to catch up).

[Travis Kroells 0]

I actualy disagree...He may not be evil (although he certainly has killed a good number of people over time) Q is a villain by defintion...(wow i just realized i spelled it wrong on the orignal post ;) )

 

vil·lain n.

1. A wicked or evil person; a scoundrel.

2. A dramatic or fictional character who is typically at odds with the hero.

3. A vile, wicked person; a man extremely depraved, and capable or guilty of great crimes; a deliberate scoundrel; a knave; a rascal; a scamp.

 

This is a creature who gets his kicks out of playing with the lesser species of the universe (just ask Guinan) and he was so corrupt in his Q-powers that he had them taken away. Add to that he does just enjoy playing with us, we are like flys he enjoys pulling the wings off of (why BTW is the first sign of psychotic behavior) Saying Q is not a villain is like saying the Vorlon's or Shadows form B5 weren't, after all they justed wanted to teach humanity how to be better ;)

 

And for clarification...being a villain doesn't make you"evil" although it certain doesn't help...the questions was supposed to be who was "best" Villan not neccissarly who is the most evil of them (becuase I thnk Dukat who was actualy ypossesed by Evil itself would win thayt contest--that would also eliminate the B-B twins because its take intellegence to be evil and yeah...we will leave it at that )...but meh...

 

I personally think Khan was the most interesting (and best acted) Villian of all time in ST...with the Borg and Dukat close on his heals. Khan was the perfect match for the 'almighty' Kirk. he was smarter, stronger, and driven completly driven blind with hatred "with my lest breath I spit at the..."

So, then I guess I'm considered a bad guy since I torture ants then huh!? Is that what your saying!?

[Cptn Moose 0]

Well, there are several things that make up a good villian.

 

The first is the idea that they're powerful and can't be stopped. I think that's what made Kahn such a wonderful character. Up until the last moment, you truly thought he was going to win.

 

The same holds true for the Borg. They weren't defeated the first time we saw them, Q took the Enterprise-D away. And all through both episodes of "Best of Both Worlds", you had no idea how they were going to be stopped. Unfortunately, once they were stopped, they lost that edge. The only time since that they regained it was in the "Enterprise" episode where Archer and crew persued them. We knew they NX-01 couldn't stop them, so the questions turned back into "How will our heroes survive this?"

 

The other thing that makes an excellent villian is the idea that you can't predict their behavior. Just being in their presense is dangerous because you don't know what to expect. The one I liked the best for this, that people seem to overlook, was Weyoun the Vorta from DS9.

 

Most of the others are fairly stock characters whose demise is forseeable and predicable.

[Dumbass 0]

The other thing that makes an excellent villian is the idea that you can't predict their behavior.  Just being in their presense is dangerous because you don't know what to expect.

That is why Q doesn't qualify as a villan. He might have toyed with humanity, especially Picard, Sisko, and Janeway (although Q and Janeway became friends after a while - she even became Q Jr.'s Godmother), but when he made a promise he kept it.

Edited April 5, 2004 by Dumbass

[NDak 0]

Q's motivations were never really to "mess" with us. That is just how we percieve it. By "messing" with us, he pushes us, like the teacher who plays devil's advocate. Now, I never watched B5, but those people were actively trying to kill and/or conquer (no matter how I spell that it looks wrong, ROFL, I need to go to bed) the main characters of the show, were they not? Q's only motive that I see is to better us, to make us think in different ways. Yeah, he probably had fun with Picard and Co. along with that, but I've always seen the jerk as a facade meant to goad the poor corporeal humans along. Q's pretty damn gentle with humanity, if you ask me. Tell me a time when Q ever actually harmed anyone and *then* I might conceed that he is a villian.

HE THREATENED TO KILL ALL OF HUMANITY BECUASE WE DIDN'T MEET "HIS" STANDARDS!!!!

 

...sorry just had to get that out of my system....anyway he is a villain regardless of what his intentions were; he was the antigonist (with the exception of the time he tried to recruit Riker...) OH and as for hm losing his powers...he lost them becuase "he had harrased humanity." That and I guess some of you don't feel for the "Ensign Ricky" he killed in Farpoint?

 

As for him trying to help humanity...so were the borg...they want to help humanity reach perfection {and seriously when you think about it the only truely Utopian society is one where everyone is a mindless drone...but thats another topic} so would that declasify the Borg as villains?

 

As for Moose's comments...I Agree whole heartledly. Infact one of the bigest problems I see with today's fiction is that the Hero almost always wins (of course the real reason for this is so corportations can make sequals). I call it the Disney syndrome--when you go to watch a Disney movie... and you know who is going to win before it starts Its not like there is any real doubt about whether or not Aladin was going to defeat Jafar..either time, or whether Simba would exact his revenge on Scar...(I would have been so happy to see the Mighty Ducks lose...) There aren't any real tragedies anymore, at least in the Shakesperian sense that the hero's lose/die. So as a result the Villian pool has been significantly weakened.

 

As I said though this is sick/sad product of today' society. No longer are producers interested in making something quality and artistic they look at the bottom line. Its "well we can't let the Borg win or we can't make anything new for Star Trek." I think most of you---even us Voyager fans would have almost enjoyed the Finale even more if in the End Voyager got blasted into a million pieces complete with some good assimlations of people lie Nelix (although I think the Borg might just have killed him instead of assimilating him...) but no...they get home in time for tea and cameo's.

 

That's one reason I have stopped watching Enterprise...its uninteresting...we all know that by the end of this whole thing they will find some cheap Janewayesque way to end this whole little temporal cold war bit and return everything to normal...although in their defense its not like they have much of a choice because to allow the victory of the Xindi and the other people (I can't come up with thie rnames..Fred fact check please?) would completly end 30 years of Trek history (although given what B&B did with Nemesis...yah might wanna watch out).

 

But I digress...In short...I think Q is a villain (not a super Khan villain)...but a villain none the less. AND being truthful doesn't make you not a vilain. But this is why we aren't controlled by the Borg...we are all intitled to our own opinons.

Edited April 5, 2004 by Ern_Ndak

[Ki'rok 0]

Wow, Dak...you put a lot of thought into that. Sooooo....

 

I looked it up..and in defining villain, the term scoundrel came up ..alot.

By THAT definition, I will retract my previous post and concur that Q is a villain.

However, I still think Khan was the MACK-DADDY. He was Kirks "Yang"...the anti-Kirk, if you will. And who has seen a better chest plate than that???

 

Wait....if we go by the STRICT villain definition...maybe we should add HAN SOLO to the list...while not Trek...he was most certainly...a scoundrel ;)

[NDak 0]

Wow, Dak...you put a lot of thought into that.

Yeah thats what happens when you have been reading poltical science arguments for 8 hours staight... ;) you tend to be argumenative... ;)

[Marris Krax 0]

HE THREATENED TO KILL ALL OF HUMANITY BECUASE WE DIDN'T MEET "HIS" STANDARDS!!!! 

 

...sorry just had to get that out of my system....anyway he is a villain regardless of what his intentions were; he was the antigonist (with the exception of the time he tried to recruit Riker...) OH and as for hm losing his powers...he lost them becuase "he had harrased humanity." That and I guess some of you don't feel for the "Ensign Ricky" he killed in Farpoint?

 

As for him trying to help humanity...so were the borg...they want to help humanity reach perfection {and seriously when you think about it the only truely Utopian society is one where everyone is a mindless drone...but thats another topic} so would that declasify the Borg as villains?

I thought he just told us to give up space travel because we were too primative, but oh well...

 

::shruggle::

 

Methinks my perception of Q has been tainted slightly by the Peter David/Greg Cox version of Q. When you're not reading poli sci, I recommend Q-Squared and The Q Continuum Trilogy by those two respectively ^.^ Ooh, and I, Q by David and DeLancie himself...if only because they give props to my gal Eddy ;)

 

And I still say that the bad guy stuff was an act with him :angry: Nothing was what it seemed with Q, y'all should know that ;) And he killed *one guy* in the *first episode* he appeared in. Pfft...if we went by first appearances with Trek the Ferengi wouldn't have telepathic immunity :)

Edited April 5, 2004 by Marris Krax