Enterprise, is it worthy?

[Dumbass 0]

I'm not sure if "Regeneration" really helped answer so many questions about 7 of 9.  When the Enterprise-D first encountered the Borg, they seemed pretty clueless about them.  I would've just assumed that Annika Hanson lived in some border colony that was attacked by the Borg as a testing ground (if the timing works out and it works with the rest of the Voyager episodes, many of which I haven't seen).

If you get a chance, watch the VOY episode The Raven.  It talks about the Hansen's "mission", how they tried to get permission from Starfleet to go (and ultimately didn't get it and had to go it alone), and how Anilka was 7 when she was assimilated in the Delta Quadrant, a long way from any Federation outpost.  (Now that I think about it they were so far away that Anika must have been born in space.)  

 

If you do the math Anika would have been assimilated a good 6 years before Q Who?, which means the Hansens must have known about the Borg long before that - long enough to ask Starfleet to go and prepare for the mission.  

 

Explaining how the Hansens had enough detailed information about the Borg to launch their mission and yet Picard didn't know anything about them until Q Who? at least 6 years later is, well, an anomaly in the space-time continum.   :)  Regeneration offers an explanation - and to date the ONLY explanation that is endorsed by the franchise owners and wrtiers.

[Trichon 0]

I am going to have to agree with everyone else.  Both Ds9 and TNG took to the 3rd season to hit there stride.  I myself think Enterprise will do the same.  The episodes started to get really good around the end of season 2.  I also enjoy seeing them introduce their "new" technology.  Its great seeing everyone not wanting to use the transporter becasue they are not sure that its going to work.  So all in all Enterprise is a decent show right now, but hopefully next season is when it will start to become it's own show and be able to become a great show.

[Travis Kroells 0]

When the Enterprise-D first encountered the Borg, they seemed pretty clueless about them.

It's my belief that after "Regeneration" Enterprise documented it and all and sent it to star fleet where it was imediatly locked up and never seen again.  Now dont take that as some answer to the actions of TNG and VOY but rather why they happened.  As stated in Lo'ami's post, D did not know any thing about the borg, and for good reason.  If starfleet clasified the event, which they most likely would we also have to believe that is wasnt unlocked later and told to captains and other high up people.

 

If they did and most of the high ups in starfleet knew, then they would have created a defense fleet and such.  And as for the hansens, well maybe they got a hold of Enterprises record of "Regeneration", or maybe they had herd of it, per se a secret cover up, that hundereds of years ago earth was atacked by these android like people called the borg. (Remember in "Regeneration" the borg hailed them and said their clasic borg speach")  By either reading it them selves or hearing the acounts by a contact etc. they headed out to prove it.  Because if it was true, then why wasnt the federation not doing anything to prepare?

[HyperDrive 0]

This brings up whether or not Picard, who travelled back in time himself to stop the Borg, would or would not know about the Borg. He went back in time, and destroyed much of the Borg. Would that not have affected the attacks on the Enterprise-D, and possible encounters with Voyager?

 

My guess is that, after "First Contact", the Borg had to rebuild much of their fleet.... and get more drones. Obviously, they did that successfully. Otherwise, a fleet destroyed in the past could not travel back into time in the future.

 

My guess is that this will all be cleared up by the end of Enterprise... and why Picard, and the rest of the fleet, did not know about the Borg to begin with.

 

Time travel is full of so many variables....   :)  

 

Another question: If the Borg had not gone back in time and try to assimilate Earth, would they have an even bigger fleet? They wouldn't have lost so many ships. But, the Borg did go back into time and try to assimilate Earth... and they lost much of their fleet doing so. Would the attack have ever taken place, since they had already lost their ships that attacked Earth in the past, and wouldn't have them in the future to travel in time?   :)  (There's a couple of questions to think about.)

 

~HD

[LoAmi 0]

himself to stop the Borg, would or would not know about the Borg. He went back in time, and destroyed much of the Borg.

A bit confused about this one, hd.  I don't think one Borg ship constitues a significant part of the Borg fleet.  Janeway, however, did do major damage to the Borg in the last episode of Voyager.

[STSF_BluRox 0]

Then why was Picard and the rest of the Enterprise-D totally unaware of the rumor?

I'd say it's a Section 31 cover-up.  Probably trying to figure out how they could use them to their advantage before letting others know of them.......

[FredM 0]

Hey there,

 

My overall point is this. Nothing presented in First Contact, and later added to in Regeneration on Enterprise is enough to suddenly say that the timeline has been altered.

 

So Starfleet has a report, in 2156, of some weird cybernetic beings who took over some ship. Great. Now, that's probably one of a million reports filed between 2156 and 2356. How many people in Starfleet Command/Captains are current on every old report?

 

Saying the information was filed, what would prompt the Enterprise-D to think that what was seen in 2156 is what they were looking at? It's logical to assume tricoder/sensor data from Regeneration is basic...kind of like scientific work of the atmosphere in 1910 vs 2003. The Enterprise-D finds a large cube in space with cybernetic life forms. How many other cybernetic beings has Starfleet found since 2156?

 

My point is, even if there was some information recorded, it would have been basic. It would have been so vague that I'd be shocked anyone would think "Oh, that must be these people!" In addition, the report is/was so old, probably sitting in some ancient filing cabinet on Level 70 of Starfleet Command.

[STSF Precip 0]

Ensign Trichon writes:

 

. " Its great seeing everyone not wanting to use the transporter becasue they are not sure that its going to work."

 

This one thing I enjoy seeing as well.  For years...we've seen Transporters used and probably 90% all the complex  systems work on the TV series.  The crew of Enterprise given the "breakthrough" technology that transporters certainly seem to be aware they are being dematerialized when they use the thing.  

 

Forgive me for being morbid, but I wouldn't mind seeing an episode where a crewman is killed via the transporter. (of course we as viewers have seen fatalities wrought by transporters before..ref ST The Motion Picture...but these characters have not)  The crew would be challenged again to overcome their fears in order to facilitate mankind's exploration of their rapidly known neighborhood.  

 

Precip

[Dumbass 0]

My point is, even if there was some information recorded, it would have been basic. It would have been so vague that I'd be shocked anyone would think "Oh, that must be these people!" In addition, the report is/was so old, probably sitting in some ancient filing cabinet on Level 70 of Starfleet Command.

But what about the information the Borg sent from the freighter that reached the collective?  We know it reached them in the 24th century.  We weren't given an exact year, but we can infer that the Borg would have been made aware of humanity at least a couple years before they would have anyway.  If not then there would have been no point to the Borg sending the message, and the Borg don't do anything unless they see some advantage to it.

 

And remember, these were 24th century Borg that were thawed out.  They would be familiar with how to communicate with other 24th century Borg.  To the Borg receiving this report it is information that would not only have been assimilated but retained.  Having found out about humanity earlier they would have sent cubes earlier.  I think it's safe to say that even if the timeline was not altered by Starfleet it must have been by the Borg.  

 

The only debate now is whether what we saw in TNG was the original timeline or the altered one.  I looked it up and I was wrong in something I said before - The Federation Council DID approve the Hansen's research project.  They thought this was important enough to spend money on.  Even if the original Archer report was burried under paperwork the Hansen's funding request would be fresher on their minds, and they must have included a considerable amount of information in their request to get the funding.  Why would the entire Enterprise crew, with the exception of Guinan, be wholely ignorant of the Borg unless the timeline had been changed?  Don't they read newspapers?

[FredM 0]

But what about the information the Borg sent from the freighter that reached the collective?  We know it reached them in the 24th century.  We weren't given an exact year, but we can infer that the Borg would have been made aware of humanity at least a couple years before they would have anyway.  If not then there would have been no point to the Borg sending the message, and the Borg don't do anything unless they see some advantage to it.

Hey there,

 

Does it matter? It can be clearly said that the message was not completed. Perhaps it included a set of coordinates, or a general grid. Borg got the information and, given their technology of that time, sent a ship. Ship arrived era The Neutral Zone (TNG). As technology improved for the Borg, were able to send more ships at faster rates.

 

I just can't agree with you here. The Borg would have been equal to modern day "Great Sea Monster of the deep" by the 24th century. Any factual information there was, long forgotten. When the Enterprise-D see this cube shaped object, they don't go looking to historical boogie monsters.

[Garnoopy 0]

::scrolls through pages of messages debating whether the entire timeline of Star Trek has been messed up::

 

And here I thought I was a nerd...

[Dumbass 0]

Does it matter? It can be clearly said that the message was not completed. Perhaps it included a set of coordinates, or a general grid. Borg got the information and, given their technology of that time, sent a ship. Ship arrived era The Neutral Zone (TNG). As technology improved for the Borg, were able to send more ships at faster rates.

 

I just can't agree with you here. The Borg would have been equal to modern day "Great Sea Monster of the deep" by the 24th century. Any factual information there was, long forgotten. When the Enterprise-D see this cube shaped object, they don't go looking to historical boogie monsters.

One or two years wouldn't have made much difference in the technology the Borg had available to them.  It's more likely the Borg sent a ship to the Neutral Zone to destroy some Federation or Romulan bases in an effort to get the two sides to fight each other and do some of their work for them, which means they would have already known of Federation-Romulan politics (from the Hansens perhaps?).  

 

However, being presented with information about humanity even one or two years earlier than encountering them by hapenstance would have had a HUGE impact on Borg expansion plans.  They now had a specific target, they now had at least a general location, and after 2 failed attempts known to the Borg popsicles they knew the longer they waited the less certain success would be.  It's a paradox to us but remember the Borg don't "think in such linear terms" as us humans.

 

And I seriously doubt the Federation would have spent resources on a search for the 24th century equivalent to sea monsters without at least a plausable theory.  The Hansens were scientists, not mythologists.  There must have been enough research available to merit further research or they wouldn't have gone.

[Dumbass 0]

::scrolls through pages of messages debating whether the entire timeline of Star Trek has been messed up::

 

And here I thought I was a nerd...

Just to sum-up my position - Yeah, right, like I've ever sumed-up anything that wasn't on a spreadsheet - I think it was already messed up because of the inconsistencies between TNG and VOY.  I think Regeneration DID change the timeline but in a way to at least partially explain these inconsistencies.

 

You know?  Those guys in high school were right!  I AM a nerd!   I need to lie down now.   :(